| 15:01 |
Tali Rosca |
Welcome to this week's questions-and-answers session with the deans of Oxbridge. As usual, this is a somewhat free-form panel discussion about topics relevant to Oxbridge in particular, and more generally Second Life as it pertains to the operation of Oxbridge. |
| 15:02 |
Tali Rosca |
Each dean has an area of expertise and responsibility (and hopefully competence), as described here: http://www.caledonoxbridge.org/qna_index.php |
| 15:02 |
Tali Rosca |
So, with that introduction done... who has a question to start things off? |
| 15:04 |
Tali Rosca |
Quiet crowd today... |
| 15:04 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
It is. |
| 15:05 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
Carl, have any comments from the Help Education Quorum? |
| 15:05 |
|
Snarkylouz (larkylouz) yells "Rah! Rah! Siss Boom ba!" |
| 15:05 |
Red Quixote |
... do you Deans have a song & dance routine to break into, when it gets this quiet? |
| 15:05 |
Martini Discovolante |
sorry, i was asking the three people hanging in the library to please take their visiting to the village chat circle. |
| 15:05 |
Carl Metropolitan |
I didn't actually attend. My area's power went out five minutes before it started. |
| 15:05 |
Carl Metropolitan |
Martini can give a much better report. |
| 15:05 |
Carl Metropolitan |
All I know is second hand. |
| 15:06 |
Tali Rosca |
Martini? Will you field this one? |
| 15:06 |
Carl Metropolitan |
For those of you in the audience, HEQ is Help Education Quorum, a coaliition of resident-run second life help and education groups |
| 15:06 |
Carl Metropolitan |
Places like Oxbridge |
| 15:06 |
Martini Discovolante |
I sent a note today to the Deans first wilt a link to Brace Coral's blogpost on the first meeting. |
| 15:06 |
Carl Metropolitan |
SL-based; not RL institutions with a presence in SL |
| 15:07 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
http://brace-coral.livejournal.com/128782.html |
| 15:07 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
There's the link. |
| 15:08 |
Martini Discovolante |
i was going to sit is an amazing effort on her part to bring together some of the oldest established Help orgs in SL and get that group together with the Lindens |
| 15:08 |
Carl Metropolitan |
I helped :) |
| 15:09 |
Martini Discovolante |
Carl helped -- yush! |
| 15:09 |
Martini Discovolante |
he and bbrace have done an amazing job. |
| 15:10 |
Martini Discovolante |
i have ot confess that i did not really say anythign untill the second meetign , Friday, about it. |
| 15:11 |
Tali Rosca |
How much are LL involved in it, and how much are they simply adding their name to a resident-driven effort? |
| 15:11 |
Martini Discovolante |
They were responsive, and Ebbe attended both meetings. |
| 15:11 |
Carl Metropolitan |
Brace went to Ebbe and requested the meeting, and the group was formed to support those meetings. |
| 15:12 |
Martini Discovolante |
we had Ebbe and four other lindens who may or may not be assigned as Liaisons with the HEQ |
| 15:12 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
Which org is Brace affiliated with? |
| 15:12 |
Red Quixote |
NCI |
| 15:12 |
Martini Discovolante |
Pete was at both, then we had Patch, Xolia (?) and Danger Linden |
| 15:12 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
kk Thanks. |
| 15:13 |
Carl Metropolitan |
Brace is the founder of NCI. She's not currently the leader of it. She's come back into SL more actively to try to fix some issues there. |
| 15:13 |
Martini Discovolante |
Brace was the Founder of NCI, and has returned to take the reins again . |
| 15:13 |
Martini Discovolante |
cause we are not giving Carl back. |
| 15:13 |
Red Quixote |
;D |
| 15:13 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
No way! ;) |
| 15:13 |
Sir Kyle Chalice (wolforphenoc) |
You know you could just clone carl and everyone wins |
| 15:13 |
Carl Metropolitan |
Actually, Wellington is still in charge there. |
| 15:14 |
Carl Metropolitan |
I don't have the energy I used to have. |
| 15:14 |
Martini Discovolante |
i guess that is true.. she said she would not do anything without checkign with Wellington first. |
| 15:14 |
|
Tali Rosca attempts to shift-drag Carl. |
| 15:14 |
Elfbiter Skysmith (elfbiter) |
:-) |
| 15:14 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
I don't know if we have Carl under abandoned claims or salvage rights, but we do. |
| 15:15 |
Elfbiter Skysmith (elfbiter) |
I think the subject's personal opinion has the most relevance. |
| 15:16 |
Martini Discovolante |
anyhow.... we got some good responses from LL they read the document we presented from the first meetign, adn responded to each issue. |
| 15:16 |
Tali Rosca |
Anyway, it will be interesting to see what comes of it. Ebbe has been vocal about residents simply being wrong about how SL works and should work, but perhaps something like this could convince him that some experienced residents actually have something to contribute. |
| 15:16 |
Red Quixote |
we had issues? |
| 15:17 |
Carl Metropolitan |
If you like, I can rez the slides from the last meeting if you think it will help explain stuff. |
| 15:17 |
Martini Discovolante |
there were many "noes" in there, but they are looking at testing on some of the Help areas, ours included. |
| 15:17 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
Red, RL Educational nonprofits have benefits in SL we don't have, for an example. |
| 15:18 |
Martini Discovolante |
whether at a glacial pace or in the very near future, i do not know. |
| 15:18 |
Red Quixote |
aye |
| 15:18 |
Martini Discovolante |
but we will have a head's up on it before it happens. |
| 15:18 |
Carl Metropolitan |
Including (up until now) being taken seriously by LL. |
| 15:18 |
Red Quixote |
so,.. what would they be testing?.. 'new resident retention stats'? |
| 15:18 |
Sir Kyle Chalice (wolforphenoc) |
Why do I worry that they're going to put electrodes in our brains and testing our responses to stimuli? |
| 15:18 |
Tali Rosca |
Perhaps we could leave the slides here after the QA. It's probably too much to start reading through now. |
| 15:19 |
Martini Discovolante |
if you read the blog, you will pretty much see what has transppired. |
| 15:19 |
Red Quixote |
that's fair |
| 15:20 |
Tali Rosca |
Though, of course, if we do not have other questions or topics, we could have people read it and quiz them. |
| 15:20 |
Martini Discovolante |
and i have ot say i felt a real dialog happening at the last meeting.... |
| 15:21 |
Martini Discovolante |
for example, we would like Titles ON to be the default agian for new people. |
| 15:21 |
Martini Discovolante |
LL 's take on it was that more info like that was confusing. |
| 15:22 |
Red Quixote |
titles on is not a default?.. that could lead to a lot of confusion fast |
| 15:22 |
Martini Discovolante |
after soem discussion on WHY it is such a poor idea, i think they aer seriously considering turning that around. |
| 15:22 |
Tali Rosca |
It is, and I am not fond of the alphabet soup hanging over people's head, but almost all newbies are surprised when they learn that they *do* have such a title hanging over their head. |
| 15:22 |
Carl Metropolitan |
They changed it to off by default in an effort to make things less complicated in a recent update. |
| 15:23 |
Carl Metropolitan |
Lots of people were running around with titles over their heads they could not see though. |
| 15:23 |
Carl Metropolitan |
And people could not see important titles |
| 15:23 |
Carl Metropolitan |
like "Helper" |
| 15:23 |
Martini Discovolante |
and cannot see the titles of those tryign to help them. |
| 15:23 |
Elfbiter Skysmith (elfbiter) |
Less complicated as in implementing the BAsic Mode? The mode every beginners wanted to get rid of? |
| 15:24 |
Snarkylouz (larkylouz) |
Yes, the day I ran into someone with the tag, "I found the G-spot" over her head, with no clue about it, I started warning anyone with a tag that was the least bit controversial. |
| 15:24 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
But that has two problems (being off). They can't see helper/tutor tags and they could have Adult wording in a role without knowing it. |
| 15:24 |
Martini Discovolante |
Basic mode-- are you speakign of the past basic /advanced model? |
| 15:24 |
Elfbiter Skysmith (elfbiter) |
The one that is now gone, yes. |
| 15:24 |
Carl Metropolitan |
The points on the slide were developed by the HEQ members via conversation during the first meeting and comments and revisions via gmail and google docs |
| 15:25 |
Carl Metropolitan |
They are proposals by the HEQ. Not things LL has agreed to do! |
| 15:26 |
Martini Discovolante |
these are the points that LL responded to, basically |
| 15:27 |
Tali Rosca |
I am somewhat encouraged by there being *several* Lindens involved. |
| 15:27 |
Tali Rosca |
To be honest, my experience with Ebbe so far is that he is saying all the nice things, and then doing whatever he pleases afterward. |
| 15:27 |
Steadman Kondor |
pardon all rl kept me occupied |
| 15:27 |
Carl Metropolitan |
And the first meeting was with Ebbe Altberg (the new CEO) and Peter Gray (Communications Director) |
| 15:28 |
Martini Discovolante |
so far, point by point.. we have MAYBE got the lindens (not Pete or Ebbe of course) as our point persons. |
| 15:28 |
Martini Discovolante |
thye will work on a more responsive destination guide (yay) but it is yet to be seen |
| 15:29 |
Martini Discovolante |
Group tags ON, we may have converts.. thye soundedmore convined. |
| 15:29 |
Martini Discovolante |
convinced. |
| 15:30 |
Martini Discovolante |
as far as a Heads Up on future changes, they pretty much said "Oz Linden has office hours" |
| 15:30 |
Martini Discovolante |
i guess we have to stalk him. |
| 15:30 |
Martini Discovolante |
but a better relationship with the TPDev group should provide us with that. |
| 15:31 |
Tali Rosca |
There are a couple of good blogs you can stalk for reports from the dev meetings. |
| 15:31 |
Martini Discovolante |
we have them looking seriously at giving us more thatn 5 posts a day per poster in Linden events. |
| 15:31 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
That would be helpful. |
| 15:31 |
Martini Discovolante |
imagine what BB has to go thru1 |
| 15:31 |
Tali Rosca |
Even more if we could get some recurring events. |
| 15:32 |
Carl Metropolitan |
Right now, there is no movement on the tier break and class stipend proposals, though. |
| 15:32 |
Martini Discovolante |
Tier Breaks? Perhaps when Beelzebub Linden takes his skiing trip. |
| 15:32 |
Red Quixote |
,.. yea,... don't hold your breath on that one |
| 15:32 |
Martini Discovolante |
but , let us not drop that hammer yet. |
| 15:32 |
Tali Rosca |
I can see why LL would be very wary about that. |
| 15:32 |
Carl Metropolitan |
It could happen. There are a lot of places given tier breaks by LL. |
| 15:33 |
Carl Metropolitan |
But not before trust is built. |
| 15:33 |
Carl Metropolitan |
And they understand what the HEQ groups do. |
| 15:33 |
Tali Rosca |
One thing is lending a hand with some people who can see what is actually happening. But once you start economically favoring somebody... I can see a lot of drama there. |
| 15:33 |
Carl Metropolitan |
That's why the subject was on the "Next Level" slide :) |
| 15:33 |
Carl Metropolitan |
Tali, they already do that. |
| 15:33 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
They've gone back to having breaks for educational institutions, which they can discontinued. |
| 15:33 |
Martini Discovolante |
they will have to create a device thru which they can give us concessions that may not be directly applied to tier. |
| 15:33 |
Carl Metropolitan |
RL non-profits with 501c3 status pay 50% for sims. |
| 15:34 |
|
Tali Rosca nods. "That is a certifiable status by a 3rd party, though." |
| 15:34 |
Carl Metropolitan |
Large customers (in number of sims rented) get significant tier breaks. |
| 15:34 |
Martini Discovolante |
Stipends? i never see that coming back. |
| 15:34 |
Carl Metropolitan |
Which is fine--normal business |
| 15:35 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
Just like we don't want teachers of classes to see it as a commercial opportunity, they don't want breaks for groups with such a goal. |
| 15:35 |
Martini Discovolante |
So far , Tali, our only member with a 401c3 is Virtual Ability, and i bet the ADA had a lot to do with that. |
| 15:35 |
Martini Discovolante |
(americans with disabilities Act) |
| 15:35 |
Tali Rosca |
I could easily see sims spring up with some nominal "teaching" purpose, just to get the tier break. |
| 15:36 |
Carl Metropolitan |
I investigated what it would take to become a RL 501c3 for NCI when I was running it, and was sort of put off by the process involved. |
| 15:36 |
Martini Discovolante |
AND it costs money. |
| 15:36 |
Martini Discovolante |
and i bet Desmond would ahve a doodle, but tht is just my suspicion. |
| 15:36 |
Carl Metropolitan |
Tali--we are already ahead of you there. There would have to be some sort of certification process. |
| 15:36 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
And filing form 900's |
| 15:37 |
Ivan (ivanvorkosigan) wonders whether we should be seeking to provide input into decision making re |
SL or SL2. |
| 15:37 |
|
Elfbiter Skysmith (elfbiter) wonders what it would mean to RL non-American educational organizations |
| 15:37 |
|
Tali Rosca nods. "I'm not saying it can't be done; just that I can understand why LL is pretty wary of it." |
| 15:37 |
Martini Discovolante |
it is not something i want to get into at all. |
| 15:38 |
Carl Metropolitan |
HEQ isn't focused on SL2. We are so not focused that when Ebbe broke the news of SL2 in our first meeting none of the thirty people there blogged it. He had to go to the third party developers meeting the next day to get it out :) |
| 15:38 |
Tali Rosca |
We don't really have any input for SL2, because we have no idea what LL wants with it. We could of course each start designing our own system from scratch, but it would not be particularly useful as input. |
| 15:38 |
Martini Discovolante |
i think that something internal needs to be in place on LL's part, and that is way down the road. |
| 15:39 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
A lot of this is administrative, however, and not architecture dependent. |
| 15:40 |
Martini Discovolante |
and all were in agreement tht alt language QRHOs need ot be included, as they were in the Gateway Program, but that will evolve as well. |
| 15:40 |
Ivan (ivanvorkosigan) |
Administration IS architecture, at some level |
| 15:40 |
Tali Rosca |
Unless LL completely murders all concepts of a user-created world, such help organizations will be relevant. |
| 15:41 |
Carl Metropolitan |
QRHO - Qualified Resident Help Organization |
| 15:41 |
Tali Rosca |
Whether we teach LSL or ECMAScript or Python or whatever LL settles on for scripting language doesn't change how we, as an organization, will work with LL. |
| 15:41 |
Tali Rosca |
(As an example) |
| 15:41 |
Martini Discovolante |
that is why it is important to establish a relationship and dialog NOW, before the feces start hitting the rotor re: SL2 |
| 15:41 |
Ivan (ivanvorkosigan) |
Agree |
| 15:42 |
Martini Discovolante |
and i for one am quite pleased and amazed at the progress so far.. |
| 15:43 |
Tali Rosca |
At the core, we have enthusiastic residents who learn how to use SL and the related tools, and pass that on. |
| 15:43 |
Ivan (ivanvorkosigan) |
And the SL2 user model should seek to preserve that. |
| 15:44 |
Carl Metropolitan |
I am too |
| 15:44 |
Carl Metropolitan |
LL has committed to quarterly meetings with us |
| 15:44 |
Martini Discovolante |
oh yes-- the best part! |
| 15:44 |
Carl Metropolitan |
And we are working (the HEQ) on some stuff we can do as a group to help each other and new residents without LL's involvement. |
| 15:44 |
Tali Rosca |
And if it does, any ground work for help organizations as recognized, supported groups will carry over. |
| 15:44 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
That's reasonable ... and an indication of willingness to listen. |
| 15:45 |
Martini Discovolante |
that and that in the HEQ meetigns it has becoem apparent that just meeting with other groups inthe same situation has become a powerful thing! |
| 15:46 |
Martini Discovolante |
and can help us all. |
| 15:47 |
Martini Discovolante |
first thing in that direction is share our class schedules with everyone. |
| 15:47 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
Are the HEQ meetings open or designated reps only? |
| 15:47 |
Martini Discovolante |
oops. |
| 15:47 |
Martini Discovolante |
they are by invitation |
| 15:47 |
Martini Discovolante |
they are by invitation |
| 15:47 |
Martini Discovolante |
and have become smaller still in the LL meetings. |
| 15:48 |
Steadman Kondor |
I hope you and carl with refocus on tier relief. We are not quite getting there to meeting tier with donations each month |
| 15:48 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
nods... Keep the latter in particular from devolvig. |
| 15:48 |
Martini Discovolante |
one per member, so as to no overwhelm. |
| 15:48 |
Steadman Kondor |
The guv has noted that we kinda - need to - stand on our feet |
| 15:48 |
Martini Discovolante |
we cannot count on tier relief at all anytime in the future. |
| 15:49 |
Carl Metropolitan |
No. We have to be responsible for that. |
| 15:49 |
Steadman Kondor |
i will be sharing notes with the deans on more of the funding campaign - will need all your thinking caps |
| 15:50 |
Carl Metropolitan |
And with the amount of financial and personal strain desmond is under we can't expect any more help than we are getting from Caledon Estate. |
| 15:50 |
Carl Metropolitan |
Please consider revisiting my idea of selling Group Notice ads to the COUG group |
| 15:51 |
Steadman Kondor |
yes we need to consider all options - |
| 15:51 |
Steadman Kondor |
that, and reworking the donation medallion (glances at dean tali) to show monthly figures |
| 15:52 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
The viability of those does depend on group notices being functional. |
| 15:52 |
Martini Discovolante |
Steadman, please also let us know the balance, projected need, we will have to start pacing events and earnign and donations on a quarterly basis.... less of a hit. |
| 15:52 |
Steadman Kondor |
yes, dean martini |
| 15:52 |
Tali Rosca |
...and of people not instantly leaving the group once they start seeing ads in it. |
| 15:52 |
Carl Metropolitan |
Could all the donation medallions be networked so they show a total monthly figure for the set, and then reset automatically every month? |
| 15:52 |
Martini Discovolante |
us = the Deans. |
| 15:53 |
Steadman Kondor |
yes that is what i have in mind - with a tier target |
| 15:53 |
Snarkylouz (larkylouz) |
Phrynne's comment on my frustration with LL not respecting the expertise we SL residents have: has anyone suggested that Ebbe et al put on alts and go through newbie training themselves? |
| 15:49 |
Phrynne |
because that is what I would suggest, if anyone were asking me |
| 15:50 |
Phrynne |
it's so ridiculous to expect company heads to run an organization where they don't understand how it works. |
| 15:53 |
Carl Metropolitan |
Oh, I recommend also we consider stealing an idea from NCI. They have started promoting their classes with their twitter account. |
| 15:53 |
Martini Discovolante |
with RFL oer we can perhaps all breathe again. |
| 15:53 |
Martini Discovolante |
fundraising at ALL durnign that time is impossibel |
| 15:53 |
Steadman Kondor |
yes exactly miss larky - they seem to be expecting effort and energy for free! |
| 15:54 |
Tali Rosca |
I am reasonably sure that is not a foreign idea to LL. |
| 15:54 |
Carl Metropolitan |
Next year we need an anti-RFL fundraising campaign. "Screw cancer; give us money instead". Well, maybe my messaging needs some work :) |
| 15:54 |
Martini Discovolante |
at both meetings, we invited the Lindens to visit us. |
| 15:54 |
Steadman Kondor |
we have some very generous and regular donors, i do know there is enough love out there for COU for us to be steady with meeting the tier demands, ensuring a stable future |
| 15:55 |
Martini Discovolante |
in whatever form they feel most comfortable |
| 15:55 |
Steadman Kondor |
We just need to put out a clear donation platform |
| 15:55 |
Tali Rosca |
But seen from LL's perspective, they can't use anecdotes and single impressions for anything. They look at the overall statistics. |
| 15:55 |
Martini Discovolante |
in the first meeting, i nearly pleaded for them to see firsthand what we are doing. |
| 15:55 |
Snarkylouz (larkylouz) |
Calas has published their need and has donation kiosks around that track exactly how much is needed withthe current donation level. Is that too tacky for COU? Granted they are 11 sims of dedicated members |
| 15:55 |
Steadman Kondor |
i hope for that too miss larky |
| 15:55 |
Martini Discovolante |
in the second meeting we got some clear positive response. |
| 15:56 |
Tali Rosca |
Personally, I think they need to *first* use a bit of common sense to lift the experience out of the absolutely ridiculous pitfalls, and *then* they can start doing detailed A/B testing. |
| 15:56 |
Steadman Kondor |
that is about 7000L per month. if we can get close to that, we're steady |
| 15:56 |
Steadman Kondor |
per week, sorry |
| 15:57 |
Tali Rosca |
We're just about out of time. Are there anything to say to round this off? |
| 15:57 |
Martini Discovolante |
how they run their system of determination is up to them. i am willing to do whatever to facilitate them coming to the irrefutable conclusion that WE ARE THE ANSWER! :P |
| 15:58 |
Martini Discovolante |
seriously -- everyone in th HEQ has been here a long time, We are all passionate about what we do. And i think that will be seen |
| 15:59 |
Martini Discovolante |
headway has already been made. |
| 15:59 |
Tali Rosca |
An interesting topic tonight, very much about the running of Oxbridge. |
| 16:00 |
Tali Rosca |
And thanks to Martini and Carl for doing the work with the HEQ. |
| 16:00 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
And this misson of Oxbridge. |
| 16:00 |
Martini Discovolante |
oh-- and i would liek to mention that we are also encouragign staff/faculty, etc to visit the other member, and to warmly welcome any who you see visititng here. |
| 16:00 |
Snarkylouz (larkylouz) |
Thank you for all you do, Martini and Carl. Of course, the rest of you do nothing at all, I know! |
| 16:00 |
Carl Metropolitan |
I just putter :) |
| 16:00 |
Elfbiter Skysmith (elfbiter) |
Bedtime for me, unfortunately. |
| 16:00 |
Steadman Kondor |
:) good night and take care, everyone |
| 16:00 |
Martini Discovolante |
night Mr EB! |
| 16:01 |
Elfbiter Skysmith (elfbiter) |
Be seeing you |
| 16:01 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
May be true, Carl, but the balls go into the hole, which determines the game. |
| 16:01 |
Red Quixote |
g'nite Elf |
| 16:01 |
Wordsmith Jarvinen |
Thanks all. |
| 16:01 |
Tali Rosca |
That's it for today, then. |
| 16:01 |
Martini Discovolante |
and we really hope that the lLindens will take the tiem to visit us, and to get a firsthand look at the new person experience. |
| 16:01 |
Gronk Seriman |
Thank you, Deans!
|